EMT #25 with Dawn Marie Raczka - Inside the Rules: Event Marketing in Pharma, Biotech, and MedTech

Event marketing in the pharmaceutical and medical device industries demands precision, responsibility, and an in-depth understanding of compliance. 

In this episode, Chris Dunn and Dana Esposito are joined by Dawn Marie Raczka, Executive Vice President of Global Business Development at BlueMed, for a detailed conversation on what makes healthcare events uniquely complex - and why getting them right matters more than ever.

Dawn Marie offers a compelling insider's view of the regulatory landscape, the structural and strategic limitations, and the creative possibilities within pharma event planning. 

The episode demystifies terms like ISI and Med Affairs, outlines Sunshine Act responsibilities, and showcases how to balance innovation with obligation.

Whether you’re an experienced exhibitor or new to regulated verticals, this episode delivers a crash course in high-stakes event execution.

• Pharma's High-Stakes Event Landscape

Pharma events are overseen by the FDA with strict rules on ISI, black box warnings, and booth layouts. One compliance mistake can cost millions and tarnish reputations.

• Breaking Down Booth Zones

Commercial, Medical Affairs, and Pipeline areas each have their own layout rules. Even hanging signs must follow regulations—like avoiding commercial product names in non-commercial zones.

• Designing for Scientists, Not Spectators

HCPs (Health Care Professionals) attend events for precision. They seek pipeline updates and efficacy data—not entertainment. Designers must align every touchpoint with this goal.

• The Sunshine Act’s Impact

Also known as Open Payments, the Sunshine Act limits the value of giveaways and mandates full disclosure of any financial transactions with HCPs. Some associations prohibit gifts altogether.

• Organizations that Support You

Industry groups like HCEA and The Exhibitor Advocate offer education, advocacy, and community for navigating union rules, regulatory updates, and strategic planning in medical events.

📌 Dawn Marie’s 3 Takeaways

1. Find the Right Partner – Work with experts who understand compliance, regulatory language, and industry expectations.
2. Build Two-Way Communication – Collaboration between internal teams and external agencies is essential for success.
3. Lead with Passion and Precision – Get the science right, communicate it effectively, and bring the right energy to every project.

This episode reveals the layered complexity of marketing within one of the world’s most regulated sectors. From legal compliance to audience engagement, every detail matters - and every partner must pull their weight. For event marketers looking to excel in pharma, biotech, or medtech, this conversation is essential listening.

👉🏼 Join us for more insightful discussions like this by tuning into 'Event Marketer's Toolbox,' where industry leaders share the tools, tactics, and trends driving success in the event world.

This Show is sponsored by Blue Hive

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Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction & Guest Welcome
• 4:39 Why Pharma Events Are Different
• 8:39 Acronyms Explained: ISI, PI, Med Affairs
• 14:39 Designing Exhibits with Compliance in Mind
• 18:39 Understanding HCP Personas
• 22:39 The Role of the Design Team in Pharma
• 28:39 The Sunshine Act: Origins & Impact
• 36:39 Creative Education for Rare Diseases
• 41:39 Importance of HCEA & The Exhibitor Advocate
• 47:39 Dawn Marie’s Three Takeaways

Transcript

Chris Dunn: [00:00:00] Hello everybody and welcome to the Event Marketers Toolbox. I'm Chris Dunn. I am with BlueHive Exhibits, and we're super happy to be here on this lovely Thursday. I've got a couple of guests. This is actually the first show where all three of us are actually Blue Hiers. So super excited to dive in and talk to, uh, a couple of my coworkers.

Chris Dunn: But, uh, real quick, I'm gonna make a quick introduction to, uh, Dana Esposito, who's sitting in the co-host seat. 

Dana Esposito: Hey, 

Chris Dunn: Dana. 

Dana Esposito: How goes, is 

Chris Dunn: it? 

Dana Esposito: Hi everybody. So yeah, I'm Dana Esposito. I am the EVP of Strategy here at Blue Hive. Um, I come from the side of exhibit design as an actual exhibit designer and also creative leadership and corporate strategy.

Dana Esposito: And I've been in the industry 30 years. So, Dawn Marie, um, let everyone know who you are. 

Dawn Marie Raczka: So my name is Dawn Marie Raska and I am the Executive Vice President of Global Business Development here at BlueHive. My main function is really [00:01:00] leading the Blue Med Division, which is the pharmaceutical medical device and life life science division of BlueHive.

Dawn Marie Raczka: I have. Been in the industry for a little over 20 years. Um, really trained and mentored under some of the very best people in the industry. And, um, yeah, now it's been an adventure being here at Blue High for about 11 and a half years in my role and at the capacity I'm at. And just really excited to join the both of you today.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So thank you for inviting me. 

Chris Dunn: Absolutely. We're happy to have you here. This has been, uh, on the books for a long time, so we're really excited to Yes. Have this conversation. Sorry about my schedule. Yeah, absolutely. And obviously Dawn Marie's gonna do, she's gonna tell you all about it, but, um, it's amazing how many differences there are from I.

Chris Dunn: Uh, a lot of the clients that I deal with in manufacturing and, uh, and, and high tech and, and food and so forth, and, uh, and her specialty really requires some, [00:02:00] some very similar but, but, uh, much more refined, uh, skill sets as I guess as it were. So, before we jump into those questions. I'm gonna just, uh, remind everybody that we're sponsored not only by BlueHive.

Chris Dunn: So BlueHive is a, is a wonderful creative agency. We're over a hundred people, but we're kind of that perfect size where we're not so big that you're just a number and we're not, uh, you know, small and, and we're boutique-ish, but we're not so small that. That, uh, we don't have the resources to get things done.

Chris Dunn: We are coast to coast, uh, Boston based as well as Las Vegas for our West Coast customers. And, uh, we bring a lot of creative firepower and wonderful customer service to the table in addition to BlueHive. We're also sponsored by, uh, the folks at, at Fist Bump. Now Fist Bump is the agency that is actually running this particular podcast, and I started coaching with them, uh, a couple of years ago to kind of upscale and upgrade my LinkedIn game.

Chris Dunn: And, uh, I don't know, eight months or so ago, uh, it was brought to my attention that [00:03:00] doing a podcast would be a great idea. So. It was tough to get off the ground until I finally agreed and said, yes. You know what? You guys are fist bump. Know what you're doing. Please go ahead and take this. The lift. Was a little too heavy for me.

Chris Dunn: And, uh, and they, they handle all the hard stuff. So we show up, we have wonderful conversations. They, they help us put these things together. This form of media, uh, really helps bring BlueHive as, uh, you know, to the forefront as thought leaders. Uh, and, and just allows us a platform to have these wonderful conversations from folks, uh, in all different aspects and walks of life within the event forum.

Chris Dunn: So, without further ado, we'll kick it back to Dana and Dawn r to get, uh, get things started with, uh, the meat and potato. Of the actual podcast. 

Dana Esposito: Yep. All right. So do Marie, can you start to tell us a little bit why specifically pharmaceutical and medical events are different from, say, other, other shows, um, other clients that are dealing in manufacturing or technology or things like that?

Dawn Marie Raczka: The number one, [00:04:00] um, difference is we're dealing with the FDA. And the FDA has many rules and regulations and compliance. So when an exhibit is created, you really have to go by the FDA rules. And so, you know, these are very outlined. Every company that approaches our team here at at BlueHive really, um. They already understand what their legal and compliance teams feel comfortable with.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Obviously there's a tremendous amount involved. So it's not just the design, but there's a whole process to the design. How it's laid out, um, whether there's a pipeline, whether it's a med affairs, there could be an international piece to it. Um, then you have your commercial space and each space has [00:05:00] really its own rules.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So because of this, that really is a good part of what separates us. And in addition, um. The FDA does walk the floor in these conventions. They are, um, constantly really being aware and it's for two reasons. So there's twofold to this. Mm-hmm. It's really to, um, the first is to protect the patient. Right, because the FDA was really formed to protect the public, the general public, you know, with taking, whether it's a compound or whatever it might be, but also, um, it's a guideline.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So when they're walking the floor and they're looking for, um. A company that is exhibiting, um, especially in the pharmaceutical arena, um, they are making sure that black boxes [00:06:00] are really shown. The ISI, uh, the, um, pi in place, right? The pres prescribing information with a tagline, um, with a compound, the name of the compound, and when.

Dawn Marie Raczka: The important aspect about all of this is that as the exhibit house and the agency really working together, um, we wanna make sure that whatever is being presented and goes through the legal and the compliance team with the exhibitor, that there's nothing that the. They can be fined because these fines are millions of dollars.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Hmm. And what makes it even a little more, um, important is that every doctor that might be using the formulation, they get a letter from the FDA stating that this company. [00:07:00] Broke part of the rule. So you wanna stay away from that. It's, it's something that every company and every, um, pharmaceutical arena, even in some cases medical device, because in some instances, more and more medical device companies are being held to a little bit of a higher standard than maybe 10, 15 years ago.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Mm-hmm. So I hope that helps. Explain really the vast importance of the exhibit house. Truly having a team that understands all the, um, intricacies of the industry. 

Dana Esposito: Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. And what I've noticed, sorry Chris, so what I've noticed in the past, 'cause I've worked at two different companies with you now, I've been very fortunate that way.

Dana Esposito: And, um, both of whom have had, you know, quite a handful of pharmaceutical and med device mm-hmm. Clients. Plus other industries, right? So there's really a vast [00:08:00] difference. Like, like you're speaking to. Um, and even from the design standpoint, you know, I learned a lot about, as the designer, how to approach that.

Dana Esposito: And there are a lot of differences yes, for our audience because we really wanna make sure that we're providing education to some, maybe trade to an event marketers who are newer to the industry and maybe haven't worked at a pharmaceutical, um, company yet. I just want to explain a few of the, um, acronyms that you used.

Dana Esposito: So can you tell everyone like, what ISI is and can you also, um, explain what the difference between, um, like a pipeline is versus, um, medical affairs or scientific affairs and consumer, because those are all very specific terms to pharma. 

Dawn Marie Raczka: Sure. So ISI is important safety information. So for example, if anyone has ever gone to a pharmacy and you've had a prescription that you've picked up, [00:09:00] it comes with a folded sheet of paper.

Dawn Marie Raczka: And in that sheet of paper you can open it up and it's important safety information. So it's the benefits, but it's also potentially the side effects. Or for example, if you have between the hours of 5:00 PM and 8:00 PM have been on regular stations and all of a sudden there is a commercial. For a pharmaceutical compound that comes up well, while the commercial is going on and you see people going in the background, you have got the important safety information being shared, or it could be written all again, FDA has to, you know, they approve these things.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So that's one thing. So for example, in a commercial space, when you're designing an exhibit. You have medical affairs. So anytime a [00:10:00] compound is launched, every company's a little bit different. But for one to two years after that commercial brand launch, you always typically will have, it's required, whether they call it medical affairs or medical information, every company is a little bit different, but the commercial people that are working in the space, you know, they.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Have a doc come up and this doctor might talk about efficacy. What's your efficacy? Is this compound? Can it be used to treat another symptom? So a second indication, maybe it's not been trial trialed yet, so immediately your rep that's in the booth has to walk the doctor. Outside of the commercial area, literally has to go into the aisle off the carpet and walk around to where Met Affairs is.[00:11:00] 

Dawn Marie Raczka: The med affairs or medical information is sourced typically with, um, nurses, nurse practitioners, and they are able to help answer the questions that maybe the p the doctor has. So that's very important. They have to be legally 

Dana Esposito: separated in the exhibit space. 

Dawn Marie Raczka: Very important. Yes. And literally you can't just have.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Like say, me affairs has a foot, for example, between. Commercial and maybe there's an area that they could squeak through. No, you don't have that. For example, Dana, you know when you build a boot, that wall's gonna come to the very end of the exhibit space carpet, and they have to walk out that aisle. There is no way that there's a reason for that.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So another thing is, for example, when the doctor might go [00:12:00] to the medical Med affairs, if there's a hanging sign. If the doctor looks up the hanging sign cannot show the commercial product. It can have the company logo. It can be generic, but it cannot have a commercial drug. Cannot show it. Okay. So that's another thing.

Dawn Marie Raczka: The pipeline area also has to be kind of blocked off from med affairs. Now it's not some, in some cases, pipeline can be within the commercial space, but in its own area it's not as rigid. Okay. So, and again, this varies from company to company. Years ago, it was like pipeline was completely blocked off too, at least with some of the clients we're working with.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Now, there's more of an ease. [00:13:00] There might be a structure wall, but it's not as rigid. And pipeline really is all the different compounds they have and whether it's um, first, second, or third. Stage trial and a doctor can go up because obviously there is someone manning the pipeline area because doctors are really, um, I love our doctors.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Um, they're always looking to see what's in pipeline. That's actually a part of a panel, um, that we've been a part of or I've been in the audience where doctors are being asked for example. You know, why are you going to these conferences? And part of the reason is they go into the exhibit hall is because they really wanna see what's in pipeline.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Very important. Doctors think all the time about helping their patients, and this is like a really [00:14:00] important way that they do that. They always wanna be knowledgeable. They're also eligible. Some of their patients might be eligible for trials. This is where they can potentially sign up for trials for their patients.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Now patients have to meet a very special criteria to be able to be part of that trial. Um, but that's another very important piece that is part of that pipeline area. And then of course we know the commercial space. Commercial space can have multiple commercial pieces. Maybe clients decide they, you know, there's a large enough space where they break up their different, um, formulations.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Um, or there's times that they have digital panels that might show everything that they offer under one umbrella. Um, but these are some of the nuances of the exhibit space. 

Chris Dunn: Thanks. That's [00:15:00] pretty specific. So, uh, I'm gonna go back and I know you addressed this, that the fines are very substantial and I, that's kind of what I wanted to, I guess just weigh in on, is that, um, uh, an infraction on the part of, uh, of the exhibiting company isn't a slap on the wrist.

Chris Dunn: It's not a, oh, you know, your sign is a foot too high and, and we're gonna, uh, you know, we're gonna take away your points or we're gonna, you know. Just, you know, slap your wrist for the next time. Like, these are substantial concerns. So obviously the pharmaceutical companies that are exhibiting are totally dialed into this.

Chris Dunn: Um, and they are looking to cover their, their butts, uh, and they need to pick partners who absolutely know what they're doing. Yeah. Right. So. So when people come in and, and investigate, uh, BlueHive as an option, and you're able to talk to them about our division Blue Med, which really single-handedly handles really all of our, our pharma and our, a lot of our med device companies and so forth, that really shows.

Chris Dunn: Uh, the, [00:16:00] the inquiring companies that we have a, we have a skillset and we have experience, uh mm-hmm. Along those lines. So yeah, that's important. It's interesting 

Dana Esposito: because, um, in, in my, you know, I, I've had clients say, like, say they make. So they make watches and they're like, but hang on. We really like to work with you.

Dana Esposito: But do you, do you work on any of our competitors that may be okay that you work on their competitor, they just wanna know or it might not be okay with them? Well, it's very different. I've noticed with pharmaceutical clients, they're like, Hey, do you work on other pharmaceutical companies? And we're like, well, yes.

Dana Esposito: And they're like, because we wanna know you're very fluent in everything that we're up against. Because they still have to deal with all the rules and regulations that are like a regular industry would have to deal with, you know, the heights and the setbacks and, and all of those things that, like your exhibit design and your CAD engineers are gonna make sure your exhibit meets that criteria.

Dana Esposito: But there's that whole second layer that Don Reed's talking about of additional. Not just rules and regulations, but laws. Um, so that's why they're like, yes, [00:17:00] thank God you're, you're already versed in our world. Now you can just help us solve our problems. Like they don't have to train us in what they're already up against.

Dana Esposito: 'cause there's just so many rules. And Chris, I noticed that, um, we have a question from a LinkedIn user. 

Chris Dunn: Yes, I saw that as well. So one of the great parts about having a live show is we can take, uh, call-ins or questions. So this question here, and I can't see who, um, who that is asking. But the question's a good one.

Chris Dunn: What makes HCPs different from other, at, uh, from attendees and other types of shows? So, at the personas that are there, the, the, the visitors. Can you handle that Donna ring? No. Let us know what your thoughts there. 

Dawn Marie Raczka: That's, it's almost similar to, it's, it's a, they're scientists, I mean, it's a different market segment.

Dawn Marie Raczka: But healthcare professionals, obviously most of them go to college. They, you know, to, to become, um, a doctor or even, you know, it could be [00:18:00] a pharm d depending upon, you know, what conference it might be. Um, and, you know, it's just, they're trained in a different mindset and a different science compared to, say.

Dawn Marie Raczka: This is gonna be really very contrasting, but say an engineer who builds skyscrapers, they have to make sure the mechanics of a skyscraper that is um, say, gonna be put up in New York City isn't gonna fall and crash on and kill millions of people, right? So doctors are very much trained as scientists. But as well as their patient advocates and their, they most doctors, if you were to ask them why they go into the profession, um, it would be my, my belief would be because they care and they wanna make a difference and make the lives of their [00:19:00] patients, um, improved and better.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Does that help answer that question? 

Chris Dunn: Yeah, I think so. And, and that was Julius by the way, who asked that question and, and I think, um. You know, if I could just add an inference to it as well, is knowing your, knowing your attendee, knowing the persona of the folks who are coming to your show. And so you have the ability to talk to them, right?

Chris Dunn: Yeah. So I think when you're talking to healthcare professionals, you're able to dive right in and talk about, um, very specific things, whether it's how it affects the patients or how is the compound made, or things like that, right? Mm-hmm. Versus if you're, I'm at a technology show. I might be talking to a finance person, might be talking to a sales person, might be talking to.

Chris Dunn: You know, somebody from anywhere across that business landscape. So I think that probably changes how specific you can be with, uh, with those, those, uh. Those conversations. Yeah. There's, and also, and I've 

Dana Esposito: noticed they tend to be seeking very specific information. Like they, they go into an exhibit knowing what they're after.

Dana Esposito: Like they'll tell you straight [00:20:00] up like, oh, I've prescribed this, or I, I don't prescribe this because I had heard this. Like they, they lay it on the line and they are very eager to always know what has been approved or what is coming down the pipeline or what could be improved. Um, that just seeking accurate.

Dana Esposito: Information so that they can be as successful as they can for their patients. And they tend to be, if we're just talking like personas, they tend to be kind of a competitive, um, if I'm just subscribing, uh, a human nature of them, um, um, when we're not thinking about the exhibit, uh, I might do something geared towards that as an interactive knowing they're seeking information that we want them to leave that exhibit.

Dana Esposito: Having learned specific information, um. So my interactives and engagement will follow that line. I'm not likely to do something that's terribly, I don't wanna say silly, but I, I likely wouldn't put like a random example. Mm-hmm. Like I'm likely not gonna put a stage in [00:21:00] there that a doctor would get up on and like do a we game where they have to like dance party USA or something.

Dana Esposito: Right. But I mean, it's a crazy bananas example, but I'm just trying to give, it's just a good example. Of they're, they're not likely to wanna make a show of themself unless it's something competitive. Um, and a little more, um, not serious, but in those, in that vein, I. 

Chris Dunn: Right. Dana, did you see the question from, uh, Samuel?

Chris Dunn: He's actually asking, you know, these Yeah. Booth regulations seem really strict. How does BlueHive design team, of which Dana leads this group, um, they, how do they, uh, how do they approach building that? 

Dana Esposito: They are, we've got somebody here can answer 

Chris Dunn: that. 

Dana Esposito: The rules and regulations in general with exhibits seem to be getting more and more strict as years go by, and some of them are for safety, right, obviously.

Dana Esposito: And all of those regulations are Yep. Check, no problem. Completely agree. Some of them. I'll just say, me personally, I don't wanna blanket statement people. I feel like some of them are a little overkill because clients are paying for this square of concrete or rectangle concrete and like. In a perfect world [00:22:00] being, you know, a designer who wants to make something super shiny for our clients, I want to use all of that space for them.

Dana Esposito: Um, um, at pharmaceutical shows specifically, they tend to also have more site line restrictions. Being able to see through a booth or traffic line restrictions, which a see through versus a pass through, are two different types of rules and regulations. Um, you also, you'll notice like a lot of pharma shows the signs.

Dana Esposito: The hanging signs tend to be very large, and then what's happening on the floor tends that they leave a lot of space between them because of say, maybe rules at that show that they have to hit. Um, so how do we, how do we come up with things that are different? Um, that is where designers brains live. Um, they can't shut their brains off.

Dana Esposito: They're absorbing everything, not just from say, pharmaceutical industry and med devices, but all the other industries that we work within. We're always cross pollinating ideas. Or if we go somewhere on the weekend, like our brains are always [00:23:00] bringing things in. So in its simplest form, 

Dawn Marie Raczka: she does that 

Dana Esposito: for 

Dawn Marie Raczka: real.

Dana Esposito: Yeah. It's, it's, it's obnoxious because it never shuts off. It's awful. It's kind pictures from the 

Chris Dunn: weekend, like, I'm in this, I'm in this retail environment, gonna believe 

Dana Esposito: this. I'm like, I don't wanna think of what work right now, but, uh, this is a good idea. Um, so, um, if you, in its simplest form, if you think of, um, if you think of like two competing, competing brands, like, just like, like something that everybody knows, like, like Pepsi and Coca-Cola.

Dana Esposito: Coca-Cola or like VW and like, I don't know, Audi or something. If you, if you picture you're gonna make an exhibit for them. And I'm gonna oversimplify, 'cause I can't draw for you right now when I talk better if I can draw. Um, but like. If you couldn't put the logo on those two, two exhibits, right? They had to be like naked exhibits.

Dana Esposito: What would be something about the structure and, and the shape, the form, the interactivity, or even the color that if you were just looking [00:24:00] at the two of them next to you go, well that one's Coca-Cola, even though the logo's not there, and that one's Pepsi. Right. That's where designers start to first make the differentiated when they're working on a project.

Dana Esposito: So every company, when a designer starts to work on it, not only do we want the designer to have a direct contact conversation for a discovery call, info pickup call with the client and your account, executive account manager. Um. We want them to have that call to ask a lot of questions. We ask questions about things like what they don't like.

Dana Esposito: People don't always know what they do like, but they always know what they don't like. We ask things about, you know, their brand, their brand guidelines, um, all that type of thing. What their, how will they know the goal, the. The show was a success for them, right? The designer takes all of that stuff in when they go to make that booth look different from say, Pepsi versus Coca-Cola, even if there are no logos on it, right?

Dana Esposito: So the designer does a lot of research before they can even start, whether they, if, whether the designer who just jumps right into modeling [00:25:00] on the computer or if the, the type of designer who needs to sketch things out in their head a little bit. Can I just 

Dawn Marie Raczka: add you guys also? You study, especially in pharma.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Mm-hmm. And the device, you study the device, you study the, the compound. Mm-hmm. You study the science behind it, so it's not just walls, you bring it alive. 

Dana Esposito: Yeah. So if it's, if it's a say it's a a medication, designers wanna know. How does that medication work? Yes. And that, that's kind of how we also solve the story of the exhibit of how it comes to life.

Dana Esposito: Yeah. Because if the per, if the attendee doesn't understand after they visit that exhibit, why that medication? Is important then, like we feel like we failed. Like it's, it, the exhibit carries a lot of weight. It is an environment where attendee needs to have a very meaningful, impactful, educational experience.

Dana Esposito: Um, so that's all, it's all very tangled and tied together. But [00:26:00] that's, that's all that designers do is they tell stories through structure and imagery and experiences. So, 

Dawn Marie Raczka: and it's so innovative and I feel like we have like. Some of the smartest, most brilliant designers here because you guys really understand the science and you translate it.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So it's not something frightening to me. I, I feel as though your team really looks at it with, uh, passion and to get the science to a precision, which will then draw in the HCPs to ask the right questions. Yeah. Right. 

Dana Esposito: And we have a, we have a, we have a very diverse team as far as the creatives here. Um, we have very high level creatives, mid-level.

Dana Esposito: We have, um, not entry level at this, at this exact moment, but more, I don't even wanna say junior, but just to say less amount of years. Right? And so they'll all [00:27:00] work on projects together so that they can all cross pollinate each other with ideas. So you'll have these very high level creatives. Basically showing and teaching, maybe say the younger group, how to think and come at a design from a strategic standpoint that way.

Dana Esposito: The sexy science. Yeah. And then you also have some of May, we'll say the younger, they're not always necessarily younger, but we'll call them younger for the purpose of this conversation. Well, maybe some of the younger people coming up with ideas and brainstorming things that they maybe they don't know, can't work, but it is the seed of an idea.

Dana Esposito: That causes something in brainstorming to come up with something completely new and different. So it's really that combination. Of the really diverse creatives that we have working together that make it really great. And, and many of these, uh, designers have worked on pharmaceutical clients specifically for a long time and, and seeing how that industry changes both in their rules, regulations, their science, their advances, the FDA, the new laws and regulations, [00:28:00] and also, um, how booths specifically have changed.

Dana Esposito: So like over 30 years. Pharmaceutical booths now are different than, like, when I first started. 

Chris Dunn: I think we're gonna give Samuel the, um, you know, the question of the day. 'cause he just got like a 10 minute super deep dive answer that, that's like its own podcast on its own. Alright, I'm gonna switch gears a little bit.

Chris Dunn: We try to bring the, the toolbox. You usually bring it in around 40 minutes or so. We're already about 30. We're close, we're 28 minutes. So Dawn Marie, I'm gonna switch gears a little bit. So, navigating the regulations. Um, we've got the Sunshine Act and you've got, you know, submissions. So I think a lot of folks out there have probably heard about the Sunshine Act, but talk a little bit about, uh, the, the role of our compliance partners and, and how we utilize them, um, when it relates to to, to those things.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So I love history and I can share a little bit of history. So Sunshine Act, actually the real name of it [00:29:00] is Open Payments. And it actually began with a small group of, um, people here in Massachusetts. And it was elective at the time and it was, they were from different pharmaceutical companies. And what was happening is, and it's really interesting 'cause I grew up and I worked for four years for a very prominent cardiologist.

Dawn Marie Raczka: And I remember very specifically, and this is when really when I was in high school and there would be farmer reps coming in and they would be giving him like golf things. They would be taking him and his wife on weekends to Florida. They would go on, um, this beautiful private yacht, um, in the Virgin Islands for a week and they would get their CMEs [00:30:00] and.

Dawn Marie Raczka: You know, a lot of that. And then the giveaways. So back in the early two thousands, there was an event that happened at one of the pharmaceutical events where the exhibit, how the exhibit company, the exhibiting company, actually was giving away luggage and the doctors were pushing in so heavily just to get a piece of luggage.

Dawn Marie Raczka: It pushed this. Custom build counter over. It was insane. So all this was happening at the same time. Okay. So the group in Massachusetts came together and they said, you know what? I think we need to start making these conference patient centric. It needs to be about the patients, not about what the doctors are gonna get.

Dawn Marie Raczka: And so this was elective to begin with, and it started with, you know, if you're gonna [00:31:00] do a giveaway, let it be something educational in nature. And more and more over time, more and more, um, states elected to start. Working within what they call the Sunshine Act or open Payments. 'cause Sunshine Act really allowed the sun to shine.

Dawn Marie Raczka: And it's not illegal for a company to give a doctor a car. Right. Not that they're going to. Right. But now there's a platform that you go on. Um, which is a, a legal site, uh, with the government. And so if you're gonna give a doctor a car, you have to list that you're giving the doctor a car. You have to list that you're giving a doctor a payment for any type of fiscal transaction, whatever it is.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So it's [00:32:00] another whole layer that was added to say the pharmaceutical or medical device company. Now again, medical device was not involved in the beginning. And then there was AdvaMed, which is an American based kind of sunshine type of organization. And then Yum is over in Europe. So right now if an exhibitor or a pharmaceutical company wants to give anything away, that's a tangible amount.

Dawn Marie Raczka: The, the government has said, okay, well, anything, I think it's 12 or $13 or under. So if you wanna give away that coffee or that cookie, um, if it's under this certain amount, it does not have to be registered. It doesn't have to be scanned and uploaded to the site, but if, if I were [00:33:00] to think, okay, I'm a doctor and I'm gonna go to 10 shows, and maybe all 10 of those events have the same pharmaceutical company, maybe it's a different audience, a different compound, whatever it might be, that's where that company has to have their legal and compliance team have to have the tolerance of really what they wanna do.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Some companies, they scan every single batch that's coming up to get that cup of coffee or cookie. And then other companies have, the mindset is, you know what? We've got one compound, we're gonna go to these many shows. Even if the doctor comes to our booth every time, it's not gonna, you know, add up to the point that we really have to go onto the site and, and put it in.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So also associations. Now, some of them are actually, they're not allowing any kind of giveaway other [00:34:00] than something that is educational. We are finding that associations are sometimes driving this. So even if, for example, I am a pharmaceutical company and I want to give out coffee and cookies. Well, some of these associations are now saying, no, we're not gonna even allow that in our floor.

Dawn Marie Raczka: We're not gonna allow it in the hall. And that because everybody's gonna be balanced and equal. And by the way, what we will provide for our HCPs are coffee stations. You know, it might have a little bite to eat, so it's more centralized versus by each exhibiting company. Does that help? 

Chris Dunn: That does, that does help a lot because, uh, I guess to, to, you know, look at the brass tacks of it is the more paperwork, the more complication.

Chris Dunn: It's just, it becomes a nuisance factor. And the docs, nobody wants to always [00:35:00] be putting paperwork in and always reporting and so forth. But I, I mean, the, the impetus of the rule is, is tremendous. Right? It's like you. I'm, I'm very happy to understand that the doctors aren't prescribing a certain medication because they got a trip to Aruba.

Chris Dunn: Right. It because 

Dawn Marie Raczka: that's what medication actually works. That's why they're, yeah. Agreed. Exactly. 

Chris Dunn: Exactly. 

Dawn Marie Raczka: Yeah. It's really, again, to protect. The, the patients. Yeah. 

Chris Dunn: Yeah, yeah. 

Dana Esposito: And I'd rather I, I'd rather see them put those funds towards the exhibit and the experience anyway. 

Chris Dunn: That's right. Exactly. I would totally agree with that.

Chris Dunn: Well, can I, 

Dawn Marie Raczka: can I share this? It's really interesting. So we had a client that, it's an orphan drug and an orphan drug is actually a drug that treats a very small population. Hmm. The US government really gives out a lot of grants to different companies to do the research to. Like for example, Tourette's back [00:36:00] in the 1970s, 19, and I don't know if it goes up to the 1980s, but definitely the 1970s Tourette's.

Dawn Marie Raczka: There was nothing to treat. Tourette's Syndrome. And so part of that, there was, and there's been different drugs now over the years, but it also sometimes can have a longer, uh, patent life. And it, again, it could be a world population of two to 3000 people, but one of our clients actually are, have an orphan drug.

Dawn Marie Raczka: And it's really interesting because what happened was is there were three different side effects to a certain disease and nobody pulled it all together. I. Like doctors were looking at, well, you've got this symptom, so you must have this, or you have that symptom, so you must have that. But the reality is they had something very different.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So what we did to [00:37:00] educate the doctors, we actually created something that was, if your patient, does your patient have this symptom? Or that symptom. Or that symptom because if they have these three symptoms, it might not be one, two, or three, but it could actually be this disease. And we now have a compound that's just been FDA approved to treat the disease.

Dawn Marie Raczka: And you know, this part of this disease is, it's almost though as though, um. A patient has big blocks laying on them, like they can't move. They, they literally, it's that bad. But this new compound, if the doctors can actually diagnose properly. So what we can do and what we are doing is working with our clients to create these really important pieces to educate doctors to say, Hey.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Let's work with you because we wanna educate you [00:38:00] so that you can better diagnose your patient. Does that make sense? 

Chris Dunn: That does, that's that's tremendous. Yeah. 

Dawn Marie Raczka: That's better than a cup of coffee. I mean, let's, that is way better than a cup of coffee. Right? Coffee's good. And another little piece, so when we were also, there was a panel.

Dawn Marie Raczka: At another association that we were able to interview doctors and every single one of them said, well, you know, we love being on the show hall. We enjoy being there. Number one is to look at the pipeline. Number two is to see where progress is going on. Number three, we love coffee and cookies love it. For most 

Chris Dunn: popular reason, 

Dawn Marie Raczka: they also go really?

Dawn Marie Raczka: To be with their peers. Because one of the things that came out of COVID was they weren't able to get with their peers. And part of the power of being with their peers is working out the challenges that they're having or being able to diagnose a patient. [00:39:00] And when they come together, that's the strength of these conventions where they're meeting, they're together, they're having conversations.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So that's where the strength of. What we do comes into play that we are part of that. Um, yeah, in the convention hall, 

Dana Esposito: I can see that anytime I've gone to a convention, anytime I've gone to a TED talk, anytime I've gone to any industry, um, you know, organization gathering, I always learn additional thing. I mean, doing this 30 years, I still.

Dana Esposito: Constantly learn new things. Mm-hmm. And I feel like the more I can learn, the better designer I am, or the better strategist I am. Mm-hmm. Or client advocate, or company advocate, or organizational strategist, whatever you wanna call, I just feel like I. It's so good to like continuous education. I learned so much when I'm surrounded by people who are smarter than me or who have different Yes.

Dana Esposito: Exposed to different things than I have, you know? Um, before [00:40:00] Chris asks his next que next question, I just wanted to give Dawn Marie an opportunity to, um, highlight two industry, industry organizations that if someone's either in pharmacy. Pharmaceutical, you know, on the client side, they, if they don't know about or if they know about and they haven't looked into yet, um, they might want to.

Dana Esposito: And that is, could you talk a little bit just briefly of like, what is HCEA and why a client, um, might want to look into that? Because they do a lot of great work for the industry. 

Dawn Marie Raczka: They do. So HCEA, there's nothing like it as an association. It was founded decades ago where it actually brings together three different powers.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So it's the, uh, pharmaceutical or med device company or life sciences. So anything in the biotech industry. And then it brings together associations. And then it also brings together [00:41:00] partners and partners such as an exhibit house, an a b partner. It could be a creative writing partner, it could be anything that, it's a catering partner, so any type of partner.

Dawn Marie Raczka: That your pharma med device company would wanna be partnered with in the convention hall. That's the third branch that that's really brought in. And what I have found, I. I actually, uh, joined HCA, it was probably 12 or 13 years ago, and they were very welcoming. I met some of the, um, I met the global marketing manager, for example, at the time, Sue Huff, um, who was also the HCA President, Carol Fields from Edwards Life Sciences.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Don Schmidt from Pfizer. These were people when I first began, didn't know even know who they were, but they were really, um. Th they were really, they broke ground [00:42:00] in the industry with how they wanted to communicate and how they wanted to exhibit, uh, at conventions. And part of the strength of HCA is bringing in strong thought leaders to educate.

Dawn Marie Raczka: During, say they have an annual meeting and sometimes they even have a marketing summit. So it just depends. But you also have all of this together under one umbrella when we meet for the annual meeting, and it gives everyone an opportunity to get to know each other. Just like when the doctors come together.

Dawn Marie Raczka: We also come together as a team. It's a small knit group, and I say, you know, small hundreds, right? And so that gives us the opportunity to have better conversations. It's almost like your tier three event, you know, um, anybody out there that has the tier three events, there's a purpose for tier three because you have better communication, maybe more one-on-ones.

Dawn Marie Raczka: [00:43:00] So HCA was founded and you know, this year we're excited because we're a platinum sponsor. And, um, really, really encourage anybody that doesn't know or has not become a member or is interested in, in an attending would really encourage you to do this. There's just, um. It's a really important place to be a part of if you're looking to grow and be educated specifically in that realm, so.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Mm-hmm. So the 

Dana Esposito: HCEA stands for the Healthcare Exhibitors Association Healthcare, so you can go to their website? Yes. Yep. And to learn more about them as an organization. 'cause like I said, they're always doing great things to help, you know, chaperone our industry, um, and bring, you know, information, education.

Dana Esposito: Um, and they do have, um. Uh, a show coming up. What month is that? 

Dawn Marie Raczka: It's August. August. I think it's like the third through 7th of August or right around there. Fifth through seventh. So 

Dana Esposito: Right. And Blue High will be there because like I said, it's an important [00:44:00] industry event to be at. Um, and Dawn Marie will be speaking, I'll actually be on a separate panel, um, leading in conversation, well, not leading the conversation, part of a conversation.

Dana Esposito: Um, and then the other is just quickly, um. Anyone who's listening, it's really important to be, look into the, uh, exhibitors. Uh, advocate with Jessica Sylvia, go to the exhibitor advocate website because especially if you're a client, you're on the client side. If there's anything that you're struggling with with your show, um, the exhibitor advocate, they can really help, um, help you with that.

Dana Esposito: You know, if there's something that like. We can't fix because it's beyond our control. The, the, the organizers are not gonna listen to us. We're not there in the end client. You are the end client. So, uh, the exhibitor's advocate is really an amazing group, so please check them out. Um, reach out to them.

Dana Esposito: They also, I know they've been at, um, exhibitor Live. They may be even have been at the Event Marketers Summit. Um, but you check them out. [00:45:00] They're very helpful for clients. 

Dawn Marie Raczka: Dana, can I add just a little bit to that, which is really interesting is so in August of 2024, Comic-Con was coming into San Diego and the union actually went on strike just a few days before the installation was going to take place, and an unprecedented deal came between the city and the unions for labor rates.

Dawn Marie Raczka: So they. The city union actually had an increase of 55%. We have seen across the board that that has gone from city to city, and that is increasing your material handling rates to an unprecedented amount, some cases up to a hundred percent increases. So the exhibitor advocate has actually been going and they've been sitting with unions and they've been trying to negotiate these.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Things. They've also been encouraging. If you are an [00:46:00] association, for example, start going to tier two cities that are willing to be more compromising and or non-union labor cities. So again, the strength of the exhibitor advocate is really the voice of the exhibitors. And I do encourage, as Dana shared, yeah.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Participate. I really appreciate 

Dana Esposito: all their effort and they're only gonna be as good as, um, all the clients that join and participate and find what some of the, the biggest common like, uh, issues to be, uh, at least addressed or solved are. So yeah, I really appreciate that group. Right. 

Chris Dunn: And there is no cost to get involved.

Chris Dunn: So definitely, you know, do some in, do some investigating, check it out. And, uh, it can only help the entire industry as a whole, as well as your own bottom line, you know, if you stand up, but as a number, 

Dawn Marie Raczka: truthfully, it's like $299 as a number and you have access for 

Chris Dunn: money. Once, once you're, yeah, once, yeah.

Chris Dunn: Access and request a little bit more information. 

Dawn Marie Raczka: Um, education and white papers and seminars, like they're, they're [00:47:00] becoming a powerhouse of information. So, absolutely. 

Chris Dunn: We'll have to actually, in the show notes, we'll have to include the episode, uh, that Jessica was on just a couple weeks ago. 'cause that, that was a, a great one to review.

Chris Dunn: So, listen, I, I do, we do have more questions on the, on the docket here. We're gonna have to go to part two because we are at 47 minutes. We wanna wrap this up. And, um, and let everybody kind of move on with their day. But this has been fantastic. Dawn Reeve shared some really great insights. Um, there's, there's this kind of not secret world by any means, but it's, it's an area that, that, uh, there's so many regulations, there's so many rules that, that have to be followed.

Chris Dunn: That, that, um, you know, if folks are wondering, like, who do you talk to? You, you gotta find a company that, uh, has expertise in this area. You don't wanna be a, an experiment. With somebody that's not done it before. So, um, one thing that we do here on the toolbox as we wrap up is we ask our guest, you know, can you leave us with three takeaways or three little gold nuggets, um, you know, for our [00:48:00] listeners, uh, something they can take away and, and maybe their actionable pieces or just things to kind of marinate on.

Dawn Marie Raczka: That's a great question. So I think number one would be finding the right partner. That is immensely important. Um, you do not want to take a risk. Um, and, and part of that really is finding the partner that understands that maybe even has a compliance team inside, um, really understands your, um, market segment.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Number two, finding a team which really understands the value of the space that you're in, but as well as two-way communication. Part of creativity is the synergy of coming back and forth, right? Like anything that's created or built. When you have a team and you're working with a partner that really wants to be a part of the intellect, the intelligence, the creativity, it's [00:49:00] really having that.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Open to a communication between agencies. 'cause there's multiple agencies. There's your own brand and marketing teams, and you have to have a solid conduit. And that would be where your exhibit house comes in, is that solid conduit and project management tool. And then really number three, and I put this as number three, but really it's the power.

Dawn Marie Raczka: Of precision and passion, I mean, really precision and passion. The passion or the precision of getting it right. And the passion of understanding what we're looking to accomplish, as well as the passion and the creativity of bringing in the intelligence and the science of, of what you're doing. So I hope that helps bring in those three important areas that I think could be key takeaways.

Dana Esposito: And the blue me team definitely has all of [00:50:00] those. So all of that, yeah. You guys, and thank you 

Chris Dunn: for the, when, when you drop the three, you know, with alliteration, the three Ps, I mean, I. Chef kiss. Right. Perfect. That's a perfect way to end that 

Dawn Marie Raczka: power, precision, and passion 

Chris Dunn: power to the people, baby. 

Dawn Marie Raczka: Awesome.

Chris Dunn: Well, this has been, this has been fun and, and really informative. We really appreciate it. Um, Dawn Marie, how can people reach out and connect with you if they want to get more specific or have more questions? 

Dawn Marie Raczka: I love to be called, um, I love emails. I'll pick up the phone twenty four seven. So my 

Chris Dunn: direct, there you go.

Chris Dunn: Your phone number is right there. 

Dawn Marie Raczka: My direct line is 7 7 4 5 0 2. 0 5 6 8. I am 24 7 for real 'cause I travel globally. And my email address is D-M-R-A-C-Z-K a@bluehive.com. You can also message me on LinkedIn. Um, yeah, so [00:51:00] I am really excited to hear from you and look forward to having a real conversation.

Dawn Marie Raczka: And truly appreciate you, Chris, again and Dana for inviting me to today's session. I feel very honored. I. 

Chris Dunn: Well, we're honored to have you. This has been one of the most, uh, informative and, and deepest dive episodes. Uh, we are, I believe, episode number 25 here. So we're almost at a half next week. Mark's a half a year we've been doing this.

Chris Dunn: Um, Dana, you've been, uh, you my, my traveling co-host here about half the time or so. Um, we are, we're building a community of, uh, of helpful like-minded event. Um, you know, professionals who, you know, want to kind of get together, share information, and help each other and just kind of raise the bar across the board.

Chris Dunn: So, um, thank you so much. Share this episode with your friends, uh, and, and associates in the industry. Um, this, uh, this episode, uh, obviously we're wrapping up live here, but this is available here on [00:52:00] LinkedIn. It's on YouTube. Uh, and you can play that forever and ever in a day. We're also on all of the platform, all of the, uh, the podcast platforms as well.

Chris Dunn: So if you like to consume, um, perhaps you're listening in the future, you know, via a podcast. But thanks very much. Thanks to the Fist bump team. Thank you to Dawn Marie and, and Dana and, uh, and our, our, uh, our sponsors, uh, both Fist Bump and BlueHive. And everybody have a great rest of your day. Great rest of your week.

Chris Dunn: Cheers everybody. Take care. See you 

Dawn Marie Raczka: later. Bye.